"The degree of protection for women and children is a true reflection of the degree of social civilization. The protection of vulnerable groups is our bottom line protection. "
Just past Women’s Day, people lamented that the social atmosphere seems to have really changed. There is less marketing to write money on the face, more discussion on the current situation of gender issues, and an appeal to face up to women’s needs. But is that enough?
We collected labels and events in various hot search lists in the past. Employment discrimination, marriage and childbearing, women’s safety, cyber violence, domestic violence cases, gender culture, sex education and the sale of women and children, with these eight topics and public events, interviewed Chen Bi.
Chen Bi has been involved in public writing for a long time, writing articles in various media columns to popularize the law. The topics she talked about covered almost all the above aspects.
Her editor called her "Huang Yaoshi of the Legal Group"-she seldom explained complicated jurisprudence and hardly showed off technical terms, but was good at using a line, covering cases from ancient times to modern times.
The following are related topics in eight fields, and our dialogue with Chen Bi.
I hope these specific weapons can help you protect your freedom in all aspects of life. I hope this weapon will be seen by more women and learn to use it.
Discrimination in employment
new weekly : A hot search like # Female Sex Discrimination in Job Hunting: HR Questioning Marriage Situation # seems to appear once every three to five times. Do you feel that the laws and regulations protecting the rights and interests of female workers have not been fully implemented by enterprises? Some people even say that "sensory impairment is greater than help." What should individuals do if they encounter gender discrimination in interviews and employment?
Chen Bi ：When you join the company, you are asked whether you are married, how many children you have, and whether you plan to have two children. This is to protect its free economy. The law gives you these freedoms, and the enterprise must provide these marriage leave and maternity leave, and it will evaluate them.
Looking at actual cases, we can say some ways to avoid hidden discrimination. We may not be able to refuse to answer questions like academic qualifications and professional qualifications when we take office. However, the problem of marriage and childbearing is ok, because it does not involve the professional requirements of employment. The potential risk is that if you say "I don’t answer", you may be rejected inexplicably.
In many judicial cases, the law has been given to women.The right to "talk nonsense"You can say I’m not married, I’m not going to have two children,You can choose the answer that is favorable to you. Even if it doesn’t conform to your real thoughts, (The law supports you. This is not a violation of your obligation, because he has no right to know this information.
What should we do if the company requires in the agreement that we can’t have children within a few years of joining the company? In fact, female workers can sign,You don’t have to implement it after signing it, because it is an invalid clause.In the future, it will not bind you, but will protect you. Just defend the rights of workers.
The Labor Contract Law also clearly states that if an employer excludes his legal obligations or restricts the legal rights of the other party, these clauses are invalid.
Implicit discrimination in the workplace is difficult to eliminate in three to five years, and we can’t wait until we are completely equal before looking for a job. Therefore, I hope that young women will know how to use the law to protect themselves when looking for a job. I can refuse to answer, saying that the answer that is beneficial to me is also a choice. It is difficult to change the status quo immediately, but it is possible to make the status quo beneficial to us.
new weekly Protecting the weak and protecting capital(market freedom) seems to be a long-standing contradiction. How should it be changed? What tools can help eliminate discrimination?
Chen Bi ：This topic is quite valuable. It was discussed 10 years ago.
Personally, I think that capital freedom, market freedom, free economy and the protection of workers and the weak are actually interlinked at the bottom. Capital and market should be free, and the underlying logic should be based on respect for people. Only by stimulating people’s subjectivity can there be a free economy. This is also the basic idea of Hayek.
When we talk about protecting female workers, we are also protecting people and respecting their freedom and rights.
Why is there such a thing now?Separation and opposition? In fact, both sides are misunderstood.Free economy is hurt, not because of over-protection of workers, but because the law does not fully protect the subject of rights..
For enterprises, their property rights are not fully protected. Workers also feel as if they have been exploited, indicating that their basic rights are not fully protected.The bottom line should be found between the two, and it is far from this stage..
Enterprises and workers should work together to find a legal framework, so that our rights can be basically protected, and then see how to coordinate.
About marriage and childbirth
new weekly ：In 2019, there was a discussion. Women in Quanzhou were fined more than 90,000 social support fees for giving birth out of wedlock. Now that marriage and childbirth are untied, has their situation changed?
Chen Bi ：In the past, it was illegal to give birth beyond the planned target. At that time, it was generally believed that unplanned children would consume social resources (such as education, etc.).Therefore, the administrative organ should levy a social support fee.. After Zhang Yimou’s super-life, he paid a huge social support fee.
After the policy of encouraging three children came out, if it has been decided to collect social support and has been implemented, it will be maintained; A decision on expropriation has been made, but if it has not been implemented, it will not be implemented; If no measures have been taken, they will not be collected and will not be treated.
new weekly ：What other areas need to be supplemented and improved in the laws and regulations on unmarried childbearing?
Chen Bi ：In some places, there may be cases where the collection has been decided but has not been implemented, or during the enforcement period, the parties concerned are listed as untrustworthy. Because the efficiency varies from place to place, we may not have time to sort out all this part.
In fact, in the past two years, the Supreme People’s Procuratorate has also been inspecting and supervising all localities to sort out such unfinished cases.Remove people from the untrustworthy list as soon as possible.. Some cases don’t need to be executed, and the parties don’t have to appeal anymore.
new weekly ：At what level is it a good thing to legalize unmarried births?
Chen Bi ：There is no pre-relationship between birth and marriage registration. In the past, you had to register your marriage first, and then you had to register your birth, so that you could get an account and enjoy preferential policies such as maternity insurance and tax reduction.
Now that there are no preconditions for childbirth, there may be more family forms.Women have more autonomy.. Originally, in order to have children, you had to get married. Now you have the right to separate, not that everyone does it, but at least some people have a choice.
About women’s safety
new weekly ：In recent years, many people have paid attention to women’s safety issues such as marital rape, sexual assault by acquaintances, sexual assault by taking advantage of their position and sexual harassment in the workplace. What should be improved in our legal practice at present?
Chen Bi ：We have confirmed that sexual assault and harassment have not fully met the requirements of international conventions against discrimination against women.Women’s disagreement also needs to be manifested through physical resistance and evidence chain..
Let me give you an example. If you have forced sex with the opposite sex and later say that he raped you, according to our current proof logic, you should look abnormal at that time. You have many opportunities to call for help and call the police. Why not?If the victim didn’t do these things, she might get unfavorable results..
For example, I took a man’s arm and went into the hotel together. We talked and laughed and slept all night. I saw him off the next morning, but I didn’t report it later. On the third day, I called the police and said that he forced me.
But from the perspective of women, we will know the hesitation and fear of women at that time. She may be afraid to act rashly because of the high position of the other party; Maybe I was scared at that time, and after discussing it with my husband and girlfriends afterwards, I thought I should expose it. However, the current law is not designed from this perspective.
Some women think, why should I find so much evidence to prove that I disagree?
From the old proof standard-you have to resist fiercely, otherwise it doesn’t mean you disagree; Develop to the second level-reasonable resistance; Then develop to the third level-"no is no"; Finally, there is the fourth level, that is, more respect for women’s "Yes means yes", and women have to say "yes" to express their consent, so that sexual behavior can proceed. This is the development of women’s sexual autonomy.
archaicThe crime of rape initially protects social order.. Later, it changed greatly in meaning, from"Protecting the ownership order" has changed into "ensuring that women are not vassals of anyone"The crime of rape really violates the individual’s sexual autonomy, that is, the right to decide who I have sex with.
Feminism has developed to different heights in different countries.The theory of "Yes means yes" was accepted by the criminal law circle under the impetus of feminists, and it was gradually reflected in the trial.We may still be in the second and third stages.
new weekly ：Victims now need to prove their violation and disagreement. In the worst case, how can we keep the evidence and protect our rights and interests?
Chen Bi ：We are free to have sex with others as adults, whether male or female. But in your free state, if you have to express your disagreement, you should first say "no" bravely.The signal of rejection is stronger.
If it continues to happen, how can we keep the evidence and hold the other party accountable?
After having a bad feeling, you canSend a WeChat description to a friend immediately.For example, I feel that this person is very violent and I am a little scared. If adverse consequences occur,This description is also very important evidence.. It’s best to passVideo traceFor example, if you were brought in, you may be photographed by the surveillance of bars and hotels. From our experience in handling cases, these are all very important evidences. Like underwear, sheets, blood stains, which can leave evidence of the other party, try to keep them.
If you decide to call the police, it is recommended to immediatelyThe fastest speed alarmYou can receive the police at home with the hotel front desk and collect evidence with the police. Witnesses are there, and towels and sheets are in the room where you lived, which can reduce the pollution of evidence.
If you wake up in the morning and find yourself sexually assaulted, you must have it.Evidence consciousnessDon’t take a shower and wash your hair at once, or all the evidence will be washed away.
If you are an acquaintance, the other party may send a WeChat to appease the victim. You can restate the matter and say that I am angry with what happened yesterday, and maybe you can reconfirm the incident.
About cyber violence
new weekly ：In February this year, there were several cyber-storms, one of which directly led to the death of a pink-haired girl. Seeing that netizens suggested the introduction of an anti-cyber violence law, if any, what level should it contain? What obligations does the platform need to undertake?
Chen Bi : My personal opinion,It may be difficult to introduce the anti-cyber violence law. Unlike the Anti-Domestic Violence Law, it relies on women’s rights and interests, which is a very important work of the Women’s Federation.But who are the victims of cyber violence? It is difficult for them to be a subject.How can the protected rights and interests be condensed, and which social organization can take the lead? I find it very difficult.
Cyber-violence is not a legal term, it is embodied in many kinds of illegal acts and criminal acts, and its related provisions are interspersed in many laws. The acts involved are also governed by the Civil Code, the Law on Public Security Administration Punishment and, more seriously, the Criminal Law.
The current laws and regulations can basically cover the specific behavior of cyber violence, forward abuse, spread rumors and slander, expose the privacy of personal information, and disclose telephone numbers for everyone to call.
If a regulation can be issued to increase the obligations of the platform, the legal relationship will still be handed over to various departments to sort out, and it may be more practical to implement it by the Civil Code, the Law on Public Security Administration Punishment and the Criminal Law.
new weekly ：In many incidents of cyber violence, the role of platforms is partially vacuum, but their roles are somewhat ambiguous, because platforms may benefit from traffic. Is there any way to establish rules to clarify platform responsibilities? For example, when someone speaks disrespectfully, the platform should remind him which laws have been violated.
Chen Bi ：Some platforms are designed with these functions.After increasing the platform’s responsibility, maybe this kind of incident will still happen.. For example, in the case of the girl with pink hair, I personally think that the platform can’t completely evaluate that this will form a cyber storm event, which is difficult to prevent.
But the platform is inert, and it actually needs to bear mandatory obligations.If someone reports to it that it has been cyber-hacked, it must immediately delete the cyber-hacked information. If it is not deleted immediately, and the victim can show evidence of contacting the platform,It is to bear joint and several tort liability..
The law gives more consideration to what help can be provided to the victims. If you encounter a cyber storm, you must quickly ask the platform for help and ask the video to be removed. If the customer service can’t solve it, just get the other party’s work number and continue to call to complain. There are many successful cases that have been solved in this way.The platform has the obligation to take you off the shelf, and you can sue the platform together if it is not good enough..
Domestic violence cases
new weekly ：What was the implementation of the personal safety protection order in previous domestic violence cases?
Chen Bi ：The proof standard of personal safety protection order is actually low. For example, your ex-boyfriend sends you 20 harassing text messages a day, all of which are swearing. If you show this evidence to the judge, you are likely to get a personal safety protection order.
As long as the possibility of domestic violence is greater than that of non-occurrence, about more than 50%, which proves that others have harassed you and posed a real threat to you, you can ask the court to issue a personal safety protection order.
If the other party violates the personal safety protection order, if the circumstances are serious, it will bear criminal responsibility, and the maximum sentence can be three years. Many cases of domestic violence have been effectively curbed.
new weekly ：In many cases, domestic violence-related cases are first prosecuted by civil cases, and there may be cases where the judgment is light. Some people suggest that more detailed sentencing standards should be adopted for domestic violence. What do you think of this?
Chen Bi ：Domestic violence, like cyber violence, is not a legal term. If you want to divorce because of being beaten, it should be solved within the scope of civil cases.
If you want to prove that the other party’s infringement on you has exceeded the Civil Procedure Law, you can take a criminal approach and initiate a public prosecution. You need to add other evidence to prove that the other party has abused or intentionally hurt you, and the law will deal with sentencing according to its own rules.
Why do you get a light sentence in many cases? Because he has obtained the understanding of the victim, he may kneel down again and apologize. In addition, as soon as the family persuades him, the perpetrator will get the understanding, which is often the important reason for the "lighter sentence" in the judgment. From the judge’s point of view, ifIf the family is to be maintained, heavier punishment is actually unfavorable to family stability..
It also depends on the wishes of the parties, whether to continue to live together.If the victim resolutely does not understand, the sentence will not be very light.
new weekly ：The decision of the parties may also be influenced by the so-called "family culture", and it is necessary to maintain a harmonious family relationship. It makes sense in law, but it may lead to the victim’s rights and interests not being well protected.
Chen Bi ：Right,The right to escape is given to you, depending on whether our women grow up to master and make good use of this right.What we can do, especially what the legal profession can do, is to give you the right and put it here. When human beings can touch tools, she may be liberated.
I think the law can liberate human beings and women as well.One is that I will give you "weapons", and the other is to rely on the awakening of the parties themselves..
I think many people think that the victim is so miserable out of kindness that she must be rescued from her unhappy life and marriage. But personally, I think thisIt is also a logic of the strong.. If she insists on forcibly saving others, she may fall into another difficult situation.
In fact, as feminism says, the weak should be respected, right? But I want to give her this possibility. I can’t let her despair. There is no chance to ask for help or escape in the future. Now there is such a help and opportunity.
Where do you grow up, what kind of life do you decide,I prefer to say that the law should not have the logic of the strong.The law just gives her a chance to pick up the weapon when she wants to save herself and escape.
About gender culture
new weekly ：How do we educate about gender respect and gender equality in the whole system of public security and inspection law? For example, in the Ram case, if we knew how to protect the victims first, the tragedy that followed might not have happened.
Chen Bi ：In fact, all public security laws have one function, that is, legal education. The police station will also do this work, but it is more focused on teaching the masses.How to properly safeguard individual rights and not commit crimes?Wait.
The education of gender respect you mentioned is based on the popularization of law.At present, it can only meet the minimum requirements, and the minimum requirement of morality is the rule of law..
If you do legal education, you will know.There is a big gap between law and morality. And many times, respecting women is actually out of moral constraints.. I think the popularization of the concepts of being kind to women and living in harmony between the two sexes is more driven by social atmosphere.
However, the domestic violence in the Ram case is not only the degree of family conflicts, but also a violation of criminal law. Ram is with a person who has no respect for life and is likely to kill. The real danger already exists, but it has not been recognized and has not attracted enough attention. Finally, it has led to the tragedy of intentional homicide. This kind of murder case between husband and wife and between spouses actually happens every year, which is very shocking.
Sex education
new weekly ：We all know that the popularization of sex education is very important for the protection of children, but some parents worry that premature sex education may lead to precocious puberty in children. What should we do about it?
Chen Bi ：I think children’s sex education must not only explain how organs develop and how sexual behavior occurs. It is to let children understand that they are the masters of the body.
We have done crime research for so many years, in fact, we can see from the defendants and victims that they may have lacked a basic education in their childhood and did not form a right.Cognition of the boundary between peopleThis may be the focus of our sex education.
When you were young, you had to tell her that your body is up to you, and you can’t let others infringe on it, and you can’t let others touch your parts. Once she established this sense of physical boundaries, she understood many things.
Knowing this, we can understand that "other people’s bodies are also the masters of others." Who am I going to have sex with? It can only happen after mutual consent. I can respect myself and others. If she can understand this, she will bravely refuse or call for help when someone invades her.
If you don’t establish a sense of boundaries in your body, you will feel that you can invade others, and it doesn’t matter if others infringe on you.. If parents don’t do this kind of education when they are young, or they are prone to domestic violence, children may learn these things in the future.
The murderer in the Ram case also grew up in a violent environment at home. No one told him that your body should be respected and your feelings should be respected.
About the protection of women and children
new weekly ：One of the hot topics last year was the penalty for the sale of women and children. What specific changes have taken place in relevant laws and regulations in recent years?
Chen Bi ：People who bought women and children at first were not punished. Later, it was developed to stipulate in the amendment that buying will also be punished. However, the punishment is still relatively light, and the maximum sentence is only 3 years. Suppose that five years later, after the limitation of prosecution, as long as I don’t commit a new crime, you can’t pursue my criminal responsibility.
Why was it so loose in those days? First, because our protection of women and children is centered on combating trafficking,The penalty for abduction and trafficking is very heavy, which can be as high as the death penalty, and the bribe is obviously much lighter.Second, in order to encourage these families who buy and sell women and children, they can actively release the children and women and prevent them from doing things that hurt women and children in order to stop the rescue.
In this way, what happened in practice? Sometimes, when it is discovered, it has been several years, and it has become a fait accompli. People get along with each other, children may have been raised for several years, and better feelings may have been established. The trafficked women may be forced to get married and even have children.She will consider: if she leaves here, where can she go again?Will it be worse than living here? Sometimes they choose to stay where they are and continue their lives.
When the people’s court tries, it will take into account the necessity of maintaining family stability. If the victim comes forward to understand, it may be suspended, and the punishment seems very light.Most of the people who bought it were sentenced to several months in the end, and many of them were suspended..
I think the situation has changed now, including after last year’s discussion, everyone knows that trafficking in women is a heinous crime, and buying it is absolutely unforgivable. And the law enforcement power at the grassroots level is stronger. In this case, can the penalty be adjusted? The maximum penalty is only three years, which is really mismatched.
Women sometimes don’t exercise their freedom of choice, but they can’t help themselves.. But what we can do is to give women the choice as much as possible, and at the same time slowly change the society.So that they should not be in an environment where they have a choice but are unable to choose..
new weekly ：You wrote in your book, "The degree of protection for women and children is a true embodiment of the degree of social civilization". How do you understand this sentence?
Chen Bi ：What is the degree of civilization of a country or a society? It is not how much happiness most people enjoy, but these weak and vulnerable groups,What kind of rights do those people who may not be seen by us enjoy?.
Women are endowed with reproductive value because they have a uterus; As long as the surname is changed, the child can be endowed with the value of breeding blood. They will become the targets of trafficking, essentially because they are not treated as living people, but only used as a tool. The protection of them by laws and institutions is the symbol of a country and a social civilization. Their rights need to be seen.
Also share the book "The Echo of Justice" by Chen Bi, which contains many popular events.
# Media People Weekly #
Author | Felicia
Edit | Gillian
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